O.K.,

TooIntegrated said something really interesting to me.  He said he sometimes puts a song on repeat on his Ipod for 24 hrs.  I used to do this when I learned guitar.  It helped a lot.

labt3krated me and said "the feeling in this track doesnt quite hit me in the face, it is just there. I think you should let your inner gut lead you when your makin music like this. Work around the feeling, dont work around what you think you have to put it."  I've heard a lot of comments like this, it's starting to depress me.

My question is if you could pick only one song  to put on repeat on my Ipod for 24 hrs to teach me about "consistent feel".  What would it be and why? (you can pick one of your own tracks,  just put the link up, still tell me why you think the feel "hits you in the face".  Here's your chance to brag!)  What is a "feeling"musically to you?  How do you create it? How do you get inspired by a "feeling"?

Thanks!

I don't know a song in particular, I know I had a mate who had the 1 Tiesto song on all day and didn't even realise that it wasn't changing, but in my opinion it all comes back a song with tension, it needs to ebb and flow, build up and break down. That's IMO what to create a track that people want to hear over and over again.

the keys is that you need to make song in your head first...what are you going to use...composition and then cr8 it on FLStudio, couse if you are making beat..and thinking what should i add next, you lose the flow and feeling

I have a lot of those "24/7 repeat" songs...i would say 1-2 in every genre i have in my playlist lol.
I don't know how to link youtube vids but feel free to search up my "best of".

RJD2 (Triphop, oldschool)

That man is a funking genius when it comes to sampling and DJing. It's a shame most ppl don't know about him.
I like all of his stuff but he made like 2 or 3 songs, that where just...mindblowing.
"True confession" is one of them. Now if you like guitars go hit this song up. Probably the sickest guitars solos i've ever heard in a song. Once the guitars come in it's like a explosion of sounds that come together. Just out of this world.
And than there is "Smoke & Mirrors". My personal favorite. Punchy drum track, soulful vocals and tunes you never heard before. Did you ever had this feeling of "damn, why is the track already over" cuz the song length is so short? "Smoke & Mirrors" is one of those songs. funk Kanye when he's talking about doing "art" and not just simple hip hop. Go listen to RJD2 and see what the "art of sampling" really is about


Cunninlynguists (sampled hip hop)

I don't have to tell you all how good they are. If you haven't heard about them by now...shame on you.
The only hip hop group were you really have that feeling that every (!) track they made was a banger.
If you don't know what quality sampling is, go listen to CL.
I think the first track i listened 3 months straight on repeat was "Nothing to give". Great hook,  really nice vocal samples and a really strong beat. Then after i finally managed to get one of their newer albums, it was "Things i dream" when i  was like oh my god. That beat is just...i don't know. You lose yourself in that track. If you listen listen carefully to the lyrics and the beat with headphones on, you forget about everything around you once the hook kicks in. Real talk.
But just listen to them and see what i mean..especially the newest album.

Then there is the coldplay "lost" remix with Jay Z.
I used to listen that song everytime i went to work and on my way home. Probably 10 times a day.
I really like the lyrics and Jay's part.

Faith Evans & Jay-Z and Biggie - A Dream
That beat was just killer, jay's part wasn't that great but that combo with Faith Evans and Biggie was really special.

Non Phixion - The CIA is trying to kill me.
I just loved that aggressive style Non Phixion had back then. Their rap was just killer.
I can't really listen that track anymore lol...i don't know how many times i've repeated that song but i can't stand it anymore..

The killers
I feel like everything they touch turns into gold. Everytime i hear a new song on MTV i'm just impressed with what they came up. All time favorite is probably "Somebody told me".
They just know how to make catchy tracks.

Hoobastank - Crawling in the dark
Great guitar work, great lyrics, great hook. Hit song.

Nonpoint - In the Air Tonight
That was my rock phase back then hah...i didn't like their other stuff but "In the Air Tonight" was just wow...heard it countless of times. So much power behind that track.

And then there was that one Thrice song...i think it was "music box"
They used that thin sound of a music box together with incredible guitar work. Just a awesome song.

After all that comes Trance!
Nothing is better than trance with nice vocals...if you ask me, trance/house producer have a better ear for vocals than hip hop cats...straight up. DJ Tiesto remixed "tears from the moon" by Conjure One and made the original look so old...lol. His remix was 10 times better than the original.
I still listen to that track every now and then...just love the vocals..fits perfect to his beat.


It's ridiculous to debate about how to make such a "24 hr ipod repeat" song...There is no recipe for a song like that cuz everyone has different music taste. There is some kind of a recipe for a "hit record"...but a hit record and a track, which hits you so hard that you want to repeat it over and over again, are two different things.

It will be some Timbo track maybe

Posted By AK beatz on 06 Sep 2009 08:05 AM

It's ridiculous to debate about how to make such a "24 hr ipod repeat" song...There is no recipe for a song like that cuz everyone has different music taste. There is some kind of a recipe for a "hit record"...but a hit record and a track, which hits you so hard that you want to repeat it over and over again, are two different things.

True....  However the Socratiic method of debating in order to reach a deeper understanding of others opinions is not quite the same as finding a hard fast "recipie" for truth and does have a place in learning as long as "knowledge" gained is not adhered to as a hard and fast rule (IMO).  Your observations (everyones) may be contradictory, however it is an awareness of the existence of other peoples "thought processes" that I am interested in rather than a "recipie".

But, I would have to agree to the assertion that trying to find "one 24 hr ipod repeat song" that is the end all and be all of Hip Hop (or any style of music) would be ridiculus. 

That is not really what I'm after, the "one song" "thought experiment" is merely a "tool" intended to focus those I asked on their thoughts on "feel".  In other words it's the defense of the "one song" that actually contains the "truth" as you see it, if you will. (By the way, your explainations of WHY you picked the songs you did were QUITE  illuminating to say the least).  A list of songs without why might be helpful, but not NEARLY as much as trying to understand what you THINK makes a song  listenable over a long period of time. Not even close...

Trying to find one song that gave the recipie for "feel" would be just as ridiculus as Galileo's arugument or "thought experiment" about shooting a cannon ball into the sky and what would happen if you had enough gun powder.  Of course this was not pratical, or even possible given the technology and resources at the time.

If not for his "ridiclus" argument we would not have satalites, the internet as we know it would not exist, and we would not be able to have this "ridiculus" argument and I would not have learned as much as I did from your exquisite expository on the "what if" thought experiment. 

Thank you for sharing your knowledge with me.  Thank you to everyone.

Johnriba, I totally feel you on this... I will hear something though and when I sit down... It's gone. It's like a mental block or something. Interesting observation.

Fisha, that tension thing was pretty interesting as well. Sometimes I guess I'm just.... afraid (if that makes sense) that I'll overdo it and sound ridiculus. I need to get over that and try I suppose. What's the worse that could happen, right? Thanks.

AK, what I found particularly interesting was not so much how many different  songs you picked, but how you isolated the many particullar tools the artists are proficient in to create these moods.... very thought provoking.

Ev-G, yeah, I like Timbo a LOT too!

Haha it's hard to overdo it. All that you really have to do is just keep layering in and out a few things each time a section comes around. I promis that it's important. Go from monophonic to homophonic then polyphonic and it will always get a good response.

The keyword is FUN.

As soon as you can let go of thoughts like "what will the others say about this" and "I should add this because they did so" the better. The most innovative and best hiphop producers always have a twinkle in their eye. There is a air of fun and enjoyment in the music that comes a cross to the listener. They are not afraid to do things if they want to, they are not afraid to sample Martha Stewards cooking show or that 80's nursery rhyme.

If you are instead of worrying about the outcome, nodding your head and smiling while producing, changes are that the listener will do so aswell. Forget about pleasing the masses, you can never make everyone happy.

Fisha, great advice I'm goint to try to "remix" this one using your advice later on... Thanks!

-=Rate My Beat=-

Sabotage, true... it's just that whenever I learn something new I kinda try to "fit in" for awhile first so I "know the ropes" and can at least attack something from an analytical perspective. There's a lot of ropes in electronic music. I think I'm tied up at the moment.  So much to remember I can't "forget it" and just make music.  Sometimes I wonder if I should just sing/beatbox my ideas and then try to "find them".  Maybee that will help me "find myself".

But yeah, I definitely need to apply this advice, I can't remember the last time I made a beat where I didn't "think too much".

Good advice, worse case senario, at least you have something that you like to listen to. Makes sense.

Seriously, this question has turned out to be way more helpful than I thought it would be. It's funny how many different points in the creative process you can "get in your own way" or add interest for the listener.

All different answers, all so true... weird.

Not weird at all, since there is no universal truth.

Try this instead, don't learn things just for the sake of learning (altough that's fun too, but in this case it seems to be messing with your creativity.) Make music, and if you in the process of doing so find a need to learn something to achieve your goal, then do it at that stage. This will keep you more focused on the goal and not the means.

It's good to know alot of techiniques and theories, but if you try to accumulate it all before you do anything with it, then it will end up being a never ending quest for glory. You could draw a parallel with collecting VSTi's and sounds. Sure it's good to have a good sample bank, but how many sounds do you really need and at what point do you start to get lost in it all? Do you really benefit from having 20000 snare hits or will it slow down your creative process too much? Instead of trying to hoard all the possible sounds before you start it might be more creative to look for that specific one if/when you need it. Or better yet, tweak the ones you have to your needs.

Possibly a very poor example, but I hope you get what I'm saying anyway.

omg i wrote like a hole page about this and the message brower funked everything up cuz of that Design/HTML ish...

Sabotage,

actually that's a great analogy... thanks.

A.G.C, dude, I gotta say I don't know why you're worrying about 24-replay. I heard one of your tracks, it sounds like some Carlos Santana type stuff. The guitar is absolutely incredible. It's all so professional, bu more importantly, it's genuinely uplifting. A lot the time I hear songs on this site that "tick the right boxes", so to speak, because the mix is clean, the song structure is good, it has lots of instruments and fills all frequency ranges adequately. But they miss the most important thing: SOUL! Music is supposed to touch the transcendental part of our nature and enhance the way we feel for a few minutes. It's not supposed to be "science", and yet yo have all these guys using a scientific approach to music. Listen to TI's stuff. When I heard he has nop music theory training, I was like "woah". That's impressive. In fact, music has been around for way longer than music theory. What I'm trying to say is, yes, there is science behind music, but if it doesn't have soul then the science is useless. And your Santana-type track is SOULFUL man. Really impressive ish, from a technical point of view too. I think we could all learn from Free Jazz as a philosophy for musical expression. Just express what's inside, and you might strike gold

Plus, the type of songs that I can listen to for 24 hours are the type of songs that I get sick of very quickly. The type of songs that I have to listen to a few times before I like them are usually songs that mean the most to me and really strike a nerve. It's like the difference between a McDonald's meal and a healthy meal. The McD's will give you instant satisfaction, but you'll feel ill after a while of having it constantly. The other meal, you can go back to it as many times as you want, and it gets better every time

Nice post Cosmic Gypsy...

I'm trying to integrate the way I play guitar and bass and write songs with making beats and mixing (which I'm completely new at). It's not going very well in my opinion. It's like having a twisted ankle or something, like one leg is good and the other almost unusable.

Like I was watching Jimmy Fallon the other night and suddenly I became fasinated with the guitar player from the Roots. Like the way he plays, it's like he's playing an MPC but he's playing guitar. The way he phrases his lines when he plays it sounds like it samples. It's the craziest thing I ever saw/heard.

Like, I was completely unaware of the slight rhytmic differences in the way certain (not all) sample based players phrase ish. I don't want to list stuff that I don't think has "feel" but (in my mind) some of the stuff called Hip Hop or Rap has it and some don't (IMO). I could be wrong but I'm sure I could throw out a name of two FL guys that (just about) everybody here would say "that's got a soulful rhythmic feel, that doesn't".

On the other hand "mood" I think (whether you like either of these guys) most people would agree that their most famous songs both create a "mood" effectively (whether you like that certain "mood" or not).

So I'm more looking for what someones thoughts are on "feel" and "mood" when comparing songs they choose to listen to than looking for a blueprint for "feel" and "mood".

Then again maybee everybody is just as happy listening to the great Hip Hop song "Sweet Home Alabama" as that country classic "Let Me Ride". I mean it's all just music right?


More "broken leg" Hip Hop... It's all the craze with the kids.

-=Rate My Beat=-

Posted By Joaquin aka Cosmic Gypsy on 11 Sep 2009 12:20 PM
Plus, the type of songs that I can listen to for 24 hours are the type of songs that I get sick of very quickly. The type of songs that I have to listen to a few times before I like them are usually songs that mean the most to me and really strike a nerve. It's like the difference between a McDonald's meal and a healthy meal. The McD's will give you instant satisfaction, but you'll feel ill after a while of having it constantly. The other meal, you can go back to it as many times as you want, and it gets better every time

Good thought, very true. Have to stop myself making an analogy about those songs being like masturbation but in the end I think that would just lack class.

Tee Hee, masturbation... (snicker)

Good thought, very true. Have to stop myself making an analogy about those songs being like masturbation but in the end I think that would just lack class.

lol. i had actually thought of using that analogy myself, and I was halfway through typing it when I realised it'd be just a little bit inappropriate!

Dirty minds think alike